tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7004461851315310562.post7805575758651723129..comments2023-08-28T15:15:35.995-04:00Comments on Murphblog: On Tenure, LIFO, and Paying for Years of ServicePaul Michael Murphyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17318098111985714443noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7004461851315310562.post-84182651125378930692011-05-31T12:26:24.715-04:002011-05-31T12:26:24.715-04:00When teachers live in the at-will employment world...When teachers live in the at-will employment world they will be laid off soon after they cost more to employ than a newly educated teacher. Do not be fooled into believing that good performance will equate into long term employment. The bottom line is cost based. The goal is least cost. Better teachers may be employed longer then most, but the bottom line will catch up to them.<br /><br />I am not a teacher, just one of many at-will employees that remain unemployed/underemployed/career changed from reduction in force events in 1985, 2003, 2010.<br /><br />Best of luck to you.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7004461851315310562.post-50161055795849647772011-05-30T21:54:51.904-04:002011-05-30T21:54:51.904-04:00yes, good points. Teaching is an enigmatic profess...yes, good points. Teaching is an enigmatic profession that, in my opinion, depends almost entirely on the TEACHER. A good one can make mountains out of mole hills.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05514067724256745623noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7004461851315310562.post-21285006472111279122011-05-30T18:17:49.178-04:002011-05-30T18:17:49.178-04:00You might consider, Tracy, that the blame for the ...You might consider, Tracy, that the blame for the current folding of the system can't be placed on the backs of uneducated Americans, but on those who benefited from the best our educational system has to offer. It was largely Ivy League graduates who took lucrative gigs at Bear Stearns and Goldman Sachs who drove the economy into the ground.<br /><br />Just sayin'Paul Michael Murphyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17318098111985714443noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7004461851315310562.post-120660121740895652011-05-30T18:08:07.611-04:002011-05-30T18:08:07.611-04:00Yes, Anita, that makes sense to a certain degree. ...Yes, Anita, that makes sense to a certain degree. Any time I hear people say so and so is a bad teacher I wonder about their criteria. There are obviously examples like the teacher who just sits at her desk and puts videos on all day, but there are other reasons people label a teacher bad that aren't fair. I know teachers who are unpopular because they take their jobs seriously and take no crap from parents and students. Are they "bad?" Conversely, I've known teachers who can't teach a lick but are incredibly supportive of their students and students and parents love them. Is that teacher "bad?" I've known teachers who have loud, active classrooms and are perceived poorly by principals because the principals are control freaks who love order and silence. It's not like selling insurance. A teacher might be a awful for one child but a perfect fit for another.Paul Michael Murphyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17318098111985714443noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7004461851315310562.post-57072864925326482602011-05-30T18:02:03.062-04:002011-05-30T18:02:03.062-04:00Fair points, Tracy. I would add that at the public...Fair points, Tracy. I would add that at the public school level I think the state should have a say in the evaluation. Not that I think people working for the state are necessarily qualified, but I've never understood how states are willing to pay people to inspect restaurants but they're not willing to do the same for schools and teachers. <br />I'd like to see states create positions for retired teachers who have been referred to them by colleagues and administrators because they were effective. I'd much rather be judged by an actual human being who spent her career in the classroom than an administrator who couldn't hack it or, even worse, a test score.Paul Michael Murphyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17318098111985714443noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7004461851315310562.post-31678028416823127212011-05-30T16:06:52.447-04:002011-05-30T16:06:52.447-04:00The education system should learn something from t...The education system should learn something from the car industry. Chrysler and the likes were paying workers a hundred grand a year to mop the floors or watch movies during shift. This is what you earned for giving so many years of hard labor on the assembly line. <br /><br />The problem with that is obvious. There was a ton of money going to workers who produce nothing. And we all know what happened to the auto industry. <br /><br />Public school systems are headed in the same direction. Tenure is going to lock systems into teachers who make a ton of money and produce no results. Then what happens? <br /> <br />The system (in this case we're talking about America's future workforce and leaders) folds.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05514067724256745623noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7004461851315310562.post-57257191315811029812011-05-30T15:56:56.864-04:002011-05-30T15:56:56.864-04:00Teachers in every school should be evaluated by th...Teachers in every school should be evaluated by three people: two administrators and a colleague who's qualified to do it. And don't tell me there is not enough time. Half sheet of paper with check boxes, a couple lines of notes from evaluators, teacher discusses evaluation with superior, goes in teacher's records. This should happen every year with every teacher. It's a succinct evaluation process that works and holds teachers accountable on some level. <br /><br />Good teachers should be rewarded. Bad teachers should be fired and told to look for another job. <br /><br />Overall performance rating should not rely on test scores alone, but the teacher's overall effectiveness in the classroom. Evaluations can be done. But for some reason, no one wants to hold teachers accountable. If this were any other industry, an "ineffective" employee would be fired and told to hit the road and look for something else you're good at.<br /><br />Maybe free agency isn't a bad move for teaching. Competition can be good and usually drives up performance. <br /><br />What manager wants their clean-up hitter locked into the four hole for 25 years if he's not driving in runs every year? What principal wants a teacher who's not performing locked into a classroom for 25 years? <br /><br />The well-known teachers in a community are well-known for two reasons. Either they're stellar teachers or lumps of crap.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05514067724256745623noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7004461851315310562.post-73585649654653978402011-05-29T23:56:39.665-04:002011-05-29T23:56:39.665-04:00I think you must be a great teacher and wish I cou...I think you must be a great teacher and wish I could send my kids to you. About the trust thing: I think everyone has had a really "bad" teacher at some point...that's frustrating and makes people wary of teachers who could never be gotten rid of. Does that make sense?Anitahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06333494452915600562noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7004461851315310562.post-34904908977750629672011-05-28T12:01:01.984-04:002011-05-28T12:01:01.984-04:005. The public sees summers off & 180+ days of ...5. The public sees summers off & 180+ days of "work" and they feel we're overpaid, having no clue how much work goes into designing effective lessons/activities, grading, and correspondence (including weekends and summers).<br /><br />6. That Boston Public television series from back in the day? I mean, a teacher whipped out a handgun and shot it off in the classroom and still kept his job.Mike Winchellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11771482167997501541noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7004461851315310562.post-29011939109486066582011-05-28T11:40:11.927-04:002011-05-28T11:40:11.927-04:00Agree Michael. That's the crux of the matter. ...Agree Michael. That's the crux of the matter. Although an interesting question is why. That's certainly not the case historically. I posit the following:<br /><br />1. Media coverage tends to focus on the negative--teachers abusing kids, low test scores, etc. We hardly ever hear about the good things that happen in schools.<br /><br />2. Low test scores from our students. This topic could take another six posts, but it's a reality about why the public doesn't trust us.<br /><br />3. We belong to unions and there are fewer people who work for unions today. <br /><br />4. We are "government workers" and there's almost no trust left in government.<br /><br />Feel free to add more.Paul Michael Murphyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17318098111985714443noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7004461851315310562.post-61419134110317024312011-05-28T10:19:51.077-04:002011-05-28T10:19:51.077-04:00As a teacher for twelve years, I understand every ...As a teacher for twelve years, I understand every point you make, and I agree. Thing is: this instability, or the threat of instability, is driving many would-be teachers away from teaching. There were changes made in New York State (where I live/teach) with regards to certification the year after I started teaching that got rid of permanent certification (I just got under the wire on that and I am permanently certified). This change forced new teachers to continually "re-up" their certification every few years by way of professional development stipulations that must be met. <br /><br />In the end, it all comes down to one thing: the public doesn't trust teachers. This is why, as much as I love teaching, I advise younger people to look into another profession if they're thinking of teaching. Sounds bad, I know, but I have to be honest with them.Mike Winchellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11771482167997501541noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7004461851315310562.post-46324333031461718382011-05-28T10:05:34.469-04:002011-05-28T10:05:34.469-04:00Yep. Which is why I'm not totally irate about ...Yep. Which is why I'm not totally irate about the governor's budget (although I do think it's more about getting revenge on teachers unions than on solving a fiscal crisis). The truth is, it's a gamble. If the tax breaks lead to more jobs, than education will benefit. But if the economy doesn't get better, than Republicans will have hell to pay in the next election. Hope it works.Paul Michael Murphyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17318098111985714443noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7004461851315310562.post-28673193942186862722011-05-28T09:57:04.625-04:002011-05-28T09:57:04.625-04:00You bring up some great points, Murph, things I...You bring up some great points, Murph, things I've never thought of. It's a system that is very difficult to fix. Everybody talks about merit pay, but how do you do it? The thing that will fix this whole mess is to get this economy going and create more revenue, and if/when that happens, continue to shrink the size of our state government and reduce our taxes.Craighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08220969200249925714noreply@blogger.com